Round Score Payouts

Discussion in 'General Discussions' started by BigC, May 18, 2018.

  1. BigC

    BigC New Member RoyalRUSH

    FatChips:
    2,639,535.95
    In the past (old fatcat) the rings or for a better word the big tables DID NOT count towards Round scores..

    As this is a TEAM SITE an individual can win the round for their respective team by winning millions...

    Is this fair to other teams?

    The millions won should be an individual payout and NOT let a team win the round...

    This is a team site....As it is right now one person can win the ROUND...

    I was under the impression their would be an individual payout!!!

    Just my thoughts on keeping the site a fair playing field for all teams!
     
  2. CoachesCorner

    CoachesCorner New Member Chief RoyalRUSH

    FatChips:
    1,784,260.48
    In the past on the old site, ring table scores did NOT count towards the team round to prevent collusion upsetting the round , if I am not mistaken they did however count towards individual round and lifetime scores.

    On these rings there is no collusion as its not player vs player passing chips so much as its player vs computer program BUT it still affects the round scores by players figuring out the system and milking it for chips plain and simple... Its not player vs player competition its just figure out the weaknesses of the program and capitalize on it and amass mega chips. This is evident by people explaining how they have to adapt whenever Joe changes the settings for the bots.

    All you need to do is look at the lifetime scores and you can see who is capitalizing from this as it is a 2 tiered level of lifetime scores those that play the computer a lot and those that dont. Dont say well everyone can play them, because some dont want to, some get bored and some just want to play REAL people and have the conversation and camaraderie. They do serve a purpose so people can play when no one is playing but in my opinion those chips should not count towards the round score for teams, just individuals

    My thoughts ( and only my thoughts so dont freak out we are all entitled to our own thoughts and opinions) are while we can all play the rings if we want TO those chips earned on the rings should only count towards individual scores not round scores for teams.

    The team round scores should be from player vs player / team vs team competition NOT player vs computer program competition. After all this is a TEAM site not a figure out and exploit the weakness of the computer program site.

    To be honest I am not even sure its possible to separate the 2 I know it could on the old site which could do a lot less than this site but only Joe could answer that.
     
    Last edited: May 18, 2018
  3. FatCat

    FatCat Administrator Staff Member Test

    FatChips:
    497,146.30
    Bazinga only won the last round because only one person transferred (30k) chips to their team pot, since every other team had 0 chips for the round, no other team got a payout. Since then, no one else ever transferred chips to the pot (or other members). I made a post about it and no one seemed to care... o_O

    Once I'm done with the new scripts (all i need to do for the new tables/games) to work with the new games I have created (since I have to work around the poker platform). It'll all be released at once since they work together. Team games will add chips to the team pot when the day is over (kinda like ToW but smaller that rewards teams). Also there will be a time when Teams (and individuals if one so wish) can spend the chips for team (or what else) sponsored games.

    As for what CC said, I can add rings where only players can sit at and chips earned there is what can be transferred to the team pot, but that involves adding more code and another table (for the database) to the transfering page that no one is even using...
     
  4. CoachesCorner

    CoachesCorner New Member Chief RoyalRUSH

    FatChips:
    1,784,260.48

    Thanks Joe.... but I am confused?.

    In the past round scores were won by the most accumulated chips by team members during tournament play and that was the team chips total that decided round placement not what people put in the team pot?
    Hence my comment about the ring tables and the gross amount of chips players are winning there affecting that.. If it worked that way on the old site Rush would have won most every round as we had over 6 million chips in the team pot donated by teamies.

    I never knew rounds could be bought by simply putting chips into a team pot? In the past players contributed to team pots so the chiefs could pay bonuses for hands , great team play etc whatever they wanted, BUT their was a limit to what each team could pay its members per round.That limit was imposed because a team won by giving unlimited bonuses to teamies who in turn right after donated that amount right back to the team pot in a vicious circle of abuse. BUT the rounds were never won by what team donated the most into their team pot how can you possibly say that is team play on a team site?

    Its a moot point because last round Bazinga had the most chips amassed by teamies during the round anyways so they would have won despite your thinking but again that total was skewed severely by what was won on the rings against the program vs chips won against other fatcatters in a player vs player team vs team concept.

    I know you never played on the old site but thats how it was.... but let us all know if we can win a round by simply placing chips in our team pots going forward rather than by our team play and helping our teamies win games and earn chips? Speak to mufasa regarding how teams won previously and how round bonuses were awarded.

    THAT is in my opinion no way to reward a team for a great round and has absolutely nothing to do with team play by saying whoever puts the most in their team pot wins????

    As for the transferring chips no one is using we have been waiting to hear how much the team can transfer to its players... waiting for a link where the chief can transfer from the team pot to teamies. for bonuses, that is the concept of the team pot..... otherwise why even have one well other than to win a round apparently.
    In the past the top 10 teams from round scores won a certain amount of chips for the previous round into their team pot, that as well as what teamies contributed is what was distributed via the chief transferring the team pot as bonuses.
     
    Last edited: May 18, 2018
  5. BigC

    BigC New Member RoyalRUSH

    FatChips:
    2,639,535.95
    Looks like a serious flaw to me to transfer chips and say that won the round.....As Coach said Bazinga won the round fair and square but what you insinuated is ludicrous.. A chip transfer should nvr be the outcome to winning a round...So much for this being a team site.
    If you think nobody cared your wrong...Hence the post i started here....
    The rings have allowed a few to gain in serious chips and all this has been done in less then a few months.....Nvr have i seen anyone gain millions to this extent.
    The program can be beat and the millions amassed prove that...
    I have took the time to play the rings/bots and i can, and have, beat them as well, but i would be willing to give those chips up to keep this as a team site and not an individual site only to see the round won by beating a program...

    Edit: Don't you think that other teams might have done the same thing if they had known it would win the round?
     
  6. Mufasa

    Mufasa Administrator Staff Member Chief

    FatChips:
    459,750.01
    OK peeps i talked to joe about the round score issue and he wasn't fully clear on what it entailed so i have cleared this up with him and the next round will be tallied correctly.

    Give us a break people he didn't know the full ins and out because he didn't live on the site to know how things were done and is still learning, im just glad hes able to do all this as we dont have to rely on a part time admin anymore he does this as a hobby and loves what hes doing so please if there are issues dont bitch over it as we will fix the issue when i can explain the issue to clarify what is to be done.

    All i ask is please send a message of the issue and we will fix it or correct it.
     
  7. CoachesCorner

    CoachesCorner New Member Chief RoyalRUSH

    FatChips:
    1,784,260.48
    I know you never played on the old site but thats how it was.... but let us all know if we can win a round by simply placing chips in our team pots going forward rather than by our team play and helping our teamies win games and earn chips? Speak to mufasa regarding how teams won previously and how round bonuses were awarded.



    I said I realized he didnt play and to check with you no bitching just stating facts.. and I realize this is all new to him
     
  8. Mufasa

    Mufasa Administrator Staff Member Chief

    FatChips:
    459,750.01
    Sorry i was aggravated when i posted yes im an ass most of the time but i do mean well.
     
  9. BigC

    BigC New Member RoyalRUSH

    FatChips:
    2,639,535.95
    Well Wes consider this a message......I understand he took over but i had hoped you filled him in on the workings of the site how it was ran and what to do....
    It is hard to sit idle not say nothing and let this carry on..Just isn't fair to other teams..
    I just find it hard to donate to a site that is broken and not a team concept in place to award the round winner....
    Winning a round is what all teams strive for...Not to have it bought and won...
    I appreciate your timely response hopefully these things can be resolved and the best team win...

    If you get this site running better i will consider but i find it hard to do so...
    I don't want to steer anyone in the opposite direction on donating...Let their conscience be their guide..
     
  10. Mufasa

    Mufasa Administrator Staff Member Chief

    FatChips:
    459,750.01
    With so much that was happening with the site and rebuilding from the ground up some details were missed as he was rebuilding the site for us all, each step he is building is getting better but as things are being built he is doing this from what he is told and if i didn't clearly explain it then mistakes were made 1 because i didn't clearly specify and 2 he done what he thought it was.

    With the lack of donations we have to figure out another way to host the site or close down, I for one cannot afford to pay the server each month so we have been looking for an alternate server options.

    if i find something cheap enough that i can pay for each month without BEGGING for help i will.
     
  11. HappyKampr

    HappyKampr New Member AMIGOS

    FatChips:
    1,768,696.65
    Thank you for all that you can do on here Mufasa, every little bit helps.
     
  12. CoachesCorner

    CoachesCorner New Member Chief RoyalRUSH

    FatChips:
    1,784,260.48
    No need to apologize, I understood the point of your message and I understand that the site and how it works is all new to Joe... my point was just to get it straightened out, hence my posting he should speak with you. My point was just to get it rectified going forward not crucify anyone for what has happened already. Whats done is done and as I have said its a moot point anyways as Bazinga won last round anyways.
    What you both are doing is very appreciated and the site is going in the right direction just pointing out some things that seem to have slipped through the cracks as they are noticed.
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2018
  13. FatCat

    FatCat Administrator Staff Member Test

    FatChips:
    497,146.30
    So after talking to Muf yesterday, I did have a misunderstanding what team points were. For the past 3 months I thought it was fine and dandy since no one responded to my post about chip transfers, again lead me to think no one cared... In that post I did mention transfering chips would affect teams and player respectively depending on the transfer, I certainly wasn't clear on what it effected, but I thought people would know what I was talking about as I had thought teams points where the same as Chips similar to how individuals since the chips earned per round is basically your points.

    Also despite what some may have thought, on the old site, chips won/lost at the rings did in fact count to team points. I checked with Muf and he said whether people knew it or not, it did count. Since no one played the rings, it was never a factor at the end of the rounds.

    Unfortunately what happened last round happened, there is no way to correct it as any data past the current round is no longer saved. I'll correct my misconception on team points for the end of this round and fix the script, as the data is still there and will remain until the end of the round. it only runs once every 3 months anyway.

    ========================================================================

    As for what Coach asked,
    The transfer section accommodates for Player to Player, Player to Team, and Team to Player. Just select the options accordingly. However only the Chief and Co-Chief have the option to select the Team to Player option. I did say that there is currently no limit on the transfers, but I did encode a limit option for myself if one is ever needed. When I talked to Muf about this 4 months or so ago, I was told DoughBoy put a limit on the chips sent out to players from the team pot because people were abusing the system to boost their individual round score. The way I wrote the transfers was Player to Player AND Team to Player will not affect round scores. Therefor not needing the original purpose of a hard transfer limit. I did encode one just incase its ever needed. I do have some tweaks to make (due to my misconception) but since transfers do not count to any round score anyway. It will still be available to use going forward.
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2018
  14. BigC

    BigC New Member RoyalRUSH

    FatChips:
    2,639,535.95
    Thanks Joe,i am glad you got things straightened out......I think sometimes it takes what it takes to get things going in the right direction...
    Hopefully the glitches slow down or better yet stop lol...

    Thanks for your time spent on this site..Don't think for a moment it goes un-noticed...I appreciate you and mufasa....
    Good to know we have a couple of good guys taking care of things for us die hard fatcat members...

    Take care of papaw lol...He doesn't like getting old lol....

    Hope all bodes well with the doctor visits Mufasa....Good LORD willing everything will be ok..

    Many blessings to you both.
     
    CoachesCorner likes this.
  15. CoachesCorner

    CoachesCorner New Member Chief RoyalRUSH

    FatChips:
    1,784,260.48
    Thanks Joe....

    I know you have adjusted the bots a few times and thank you for that, but being a program that is predictable real players simply adjust to the changes and dominate them over and over as often as you adjust them .As a result they amass round changing amounts of chips. The bots dont adapt like humans they become totally predictable with repetitive play and are as has been seen ripe to milk for chips despite the changes. It is impossible to make a computer program totally unpredictable.

    If the bot chips count towards the round that is the only thing that will determine round winners... not stellar team play, not player vs player poker skills., not dominating TOW or MOW games.. just what team has the most players willing to be spend hours playing the bots to amass as many cheap chips as possible.

    There was a player on the old site that took a lot of flak for registering for every game and just folding to make the chips and be the top chip holder , not playing to become the top chip leader on the site On this new version it is the bot miners that are taking this position as top chip player its not the best poker players , and certainly not the best team play players its just whoever plays enough to know the program to learn how to milk it and is willing to put in the time to build chips using the programs habits as opposed to human players who adapt according to the current situation.

    The bots serve a purpose to allow people to play when no players are available to play against but they should not be what decides the top team in a round in my opinion.

    Its Not quite my idea of a team play site,and how to determine the top team , once again just my opinion and thoughts
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2018
    BigC likes this.
  16. BigC

    BigC New Member RoyalRUSH

    FatChips:
    2,639,535.95
    Well said
     
  17. FatCat

    FatCat Administrator Staff Member Test

    FatChips:
    497,146.30
  18. GOTCHA2017

    GOTCHA2017 New Member

    FatChips:
    4,372,936.35
    I don't play enough to really see what is happening. I thought team points were the total chips earned by every player on that team for that round. If you go back far enough in fat cat history you will find there was also a round and lifetime freeroll standings to separate those who didn't play the rings a lot. The team standings always included both as I remember several who played the rings having a negative chip count that went against the teams total. There are several ways to count team points and I would be happy with any of them. Once it is established then I think everyone will work hard at getting their team points each round. As for donations, I am a little tired of people threatening to stop donations if they don't get the response they want. I have donated well over 1000.00 to this site and continue with a minimum of 30.00 each month. I continued this even when I quit this site because of hateful and sarcastic comments towards me. Even though my play here has diminished I will still donate until such time the site is no longer able to support itself. I appreciate all the distraction it provided when my wife was dying of cancer. It gave me something to do while she slept and I had completed all the chores. This site has had its share of troubles, but the one thing I have noticed is the family it has produced as we united around those who died and are no longer with us. We all have become closer because of those friendships and miss them all. For that reason I will always be grateful. It makes all the negative things seem small in retrospect. God bless everyone on this site and I wish you all well in the days to come. I still will be playing and trying to say "Gotcha"! ;)
     
  19. CoachesCorner

    CoachesCorner New Member Chief RoyalRUSH

    FatChips:
    1,784,260.48
    be it positive or be it negative the rings were always played against HUMAN competition, at one point the rings were not counted I am sure because of collusion between players just to pass chips..

    The latest version of the rings is IMO just a passtime.. its against a computer program that is not human and behaves a certain way time after time.. if you play enough you can figure that program out as has been proven ( just look at the scores of players that play them non stop ) , change the settings and the humans will just adapt to the changes and continue to milk them , the program will never adapt the bots will always be what they are plain and simple they are not human and can only do what the program tells them to do.

    This is a team site is it not?.. should the chips that decide the round not be won or lost against fellow fatcat players and teamie helping teamie, team vs team ? Is that not the premise of this whole site? If fatcat is to become a site where whoever can beat the computer wins let me know because that is not what I signed up for.

    With the ring scores included one or 2 people on single team who are willing to put in time and milk the bots could skew the round scores severely, and dont tell me the players who play the rings consistently can also lose as the lifetime and round scores indicate quite clearly they do not lose they simply accumulate gross amounts of chips over players who dont play them. That is fine for the lifetime scores although in my mind its akin to a certain player on the old site who registered for almost every game, never played a hand just to accumulate chips and be the lifetime leader...but to each their own its their time to waste as they see fit same as it was on the old site.

    the rings serve a purpose to allow people to play when no one is here and that is fantastic,but they shoud NOT be the deciding factor on who wins a round unless they are player against player not figuring out a program to amass as many chips without human competition as possible. At this point the rings are 99% against the computer not against fellow fatcatters.

    No threats just logic, if this is indeed a team site then the winning teams points should be decided against other human players mano et mano ( sorry ladies just a phrase lol) not mano et computer chip.

    Just my thoughts towards this.. they should count towards lifetime scores but not towards round scores unless there was a ring table with no bots just humans then those chips from that table should count unless as in the past its proven teams are passing chips there..but thats a dilemma for another day
     
    Last edited: May 23, 2018
  20. MissMousse

    MissMousse New Member Chief Bazinga

    FatChips:
    2,134,218.72
    most of us play on the rings to pass the time when there are not enough to get a game to launch. CC you yourself have said many time that you also play the rings until you tire of boredom, I've seen several of you teammates on the same ring tables gathering chips when they are also bored. Please don't just single out some, when we are all doing the same thing. jmo.
     

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